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Jan 2, 2025
1:49
:06
pm
Haysom Till
Truly Addicted User
same speed and velocity on every throw. I think part of it is his throwing mechanics.
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Haysom Till
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OMIllionaire
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Haysom Till
Joined
Mar 28, 2016
Last login
Jan 4, 2025
Total posts
7,850 (62 FO)
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Messages
Author
Time
Jake is such a like-able guy and we were 11-2, so hard to critique... but we must. 4 INTs in that game. Stay with me....
Haysom Till
Truly Addicted User
Jan 2, 1:39pm
Getting mad about an offsides INT is hilarious lol
arcawley
Jan 2, 1:42pm
I'm not mad. I'm being objective.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:43pm
For that particular play, you're being objectively absurd
Indy Coug
Jan 2, 1:43pm
I don't think it's absurd to point out that on our free play he threw a wobbly duck straight into lil Sanders arms. How
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:54pm
Well, you at least know you have everyone else's support but mine on this point
Indy Coug
Jan 2, 1:57pm
touche
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:15pm
He knew it was a free play and just threw it up there for grabs on purpose. Wr
viper
Jan 2, 6:57pm
I think he makes a valid point.
Da Cougars
Jan 2, 2:53pm
He doesn’t throw that without the offsides
maxpowers
Jan 2, 1:44pm
of course. but his throw was so horrible. wasn't catchable by any of our guys and was catchable by CU which was my point
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:45pm
it wasn't catchable by a BYU WR as the WR was interfered with, despite the lack of a DPI flag
Littlerich
Jan 2, 1:51pm
Oh man, this is pointless.
Belboz
Jan 2, 2:21pm
We should've been mad if he didn't taken that shot downfield
thewaterboy
Jan 2, 1:46pm
of course. red herring argument. It's that he is inaccurate, not that he took a downfield shot on a free play.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:56pm
Watch that play again. I thought it should have been pass interference against
King of Y
Jan 2, 2:19pm
I thought so too and did rewatch it a number of times. Def could have been PI.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:27pm
So then why call it a terrible throw? If not pulled down by DB, likely a catch
King of Y
Jan 2, 2:34pm
It was badly under thrown, that’s why it wasn’t PI
CameronG
Jan 2, 7:28pm
That's not what I saw at all. You can't say with any certainty whatsoever that it was "likely a catch". Speculative at
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:02pm
No - "objective" is accepting that on a free play, the QB is supposed to...
Eddie
Jan 2, 5:03pm
Objective is 57% completion percentage, lots of INTs, and lots of red zone turnovers. And throwing it straight to the
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:20pm
Not like it was the only one of the game - pt he’s making
truecougster
Jan 2, 7:40pm
I am taking the positive road, TNT note please, and believe he will improve.
Archaea
Jan 2, 1:42pm
I hope so as well. We didn't feel the pain of the INTs this year as much cuz our team was better overall, but he ended
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:44pm
It seems he wanted to make a hero throw and he needs to let the game come to him
Archaea
Jan 2, 1:52pm
100%. I guess that is a gunslinger mentality.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:56pm
He doesn't have Josh Allen's arm strength or accuracy, but he thinks he does.
Archaea
Jan 2, 2:04pm
Agreed. He's Brett Favre minus the fact that he ain't Brett Favre.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:09pm
You bring up Josh Allen...
SoCalCoug
Jan 2, 2:17pm
Josh Allen completely revamped his arm motion upon becoming a pro.
Archaea
Jan 2, 2:20pm
Ok...
SoCalCoug
Jan 2, 3:43pm
But what about those who think improvement is impossible?
Plantagenet
Jan 2, 5:44pm
Sorry, you don’t get to count an INT on an offsides call when he was taking a shot that was not the play call.
mulletino
Jan 2, 1:42pm
Officially he had 2. We can bury our head in the sand and pretend he is an accurate passer.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:43pm
Or we can make stuff up to try and support our point.
Ozymandias
Jan 2, 1:44pm
Nothing I stated is made up. Again, objectivity can smack us in the face at times. I think we ended the season on such
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:54pm
He didn’t throw 4 INTs. That is made up.
Ozymandias
Jan 2, 1:59pm
What happend on the free play? What happened on the 2-point conversion? Tell me in your own words.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:02pm
The free play didn’t count and was an offsides penalty. The 2 point conversion
Ozymandias
Jan 2, 2:16pm
This reads like a CNN headline... "Plane crashes into building". "Truck crashes into people". "Trump falls while
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:07pm
Do you think other QBs don't do similar things? how much football do you watch?
Belboz
Jan 2, 2:22pm
CB loves the ad hominem fallacy. It's so lazy to attack the messenger instead of address the message.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:29pm
Yes, the only reason it wasn't close was Chase was trying to sell a PI call. Definitely not on Retzlaff
kimdaddy35
Jan 2, 1:46pm
<< Deleted >>
chilawcoug
Jan 2, 2:12pm
I am not officially counting it, merely demonstrating that even on free plays with no pressure he is sadly inaccurate.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:22pm
On a free play I'd much rather the QB throw a deep interception than throw a
Salami Karate
Jan 2, 1:44pm
Me too.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:46pm
Nobody is mad he took a deep shot. But it seemed way off.
JuicyJam
Jan 2, 1:46pm
correct. He made the right decision to gamble when an INT doesn't hurt us. I'm 100% on board with that. It was just very
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:48pm
Are those the only two options?
thirdgencoug
Jan 2, 8:21pm
Something was up with that pass on the free play.
JuicyJam
Jan 2, 1:44pm
My biggest thing with Jake is to figure out 2 things. How/when to throw the end zone fade, and more selectivity when
Bob Vance
Jan 2, 1:46pm
My biggest thing for him in the off-season would be to learn some touch. I've never seen a college QB
kimdaddy35
Jan 2, 1:47pm
same speed and velocity on every throw. I think part of it is his throwing mechanics.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:49pm
Obviously you don't remember Jake Heaps. He rifled the ball on a 5 yard out
SUAVO
Jan 2, 1:58pm
It’s well documented that I am no Jake apologist but the INT on the offsides is
rivercitycoug
Jan 2, 1:46pm
it was the correct call but doesn't negate that it was a wildly inaccurate throw, highlighting my point. He's not
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:50pm
Yes it does negate it. He’s improvising and completely off-script. Arguing style
xgbs
Jan 2, 3:18pm
You keep ignoring that there was PI on the play. If there no PI, it is accurate
NYC and Japan
Jan 2, 3:18pm
Ehhh, I will give you the INT is a problem, but for mostly two reasons...
ChinaFan
Jan 2, 1:49pm
I've resigned myself to see Jake as an Academy QB. A few options, limited passing, keep the offense moving.
GfB
Jan 2, 1:52pm
While I agree with a lot of that, Jake also saved them on many drives and plays.
Blew
Jan 2, 1:53pm
agreed on all your points. I did notice the last half of the season though, he stopped scrambling as much. Seemed like
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 1:58pm
Jake is a good QB. We are hoping he can take the next step to be a very good QB
mudpupper
Jan 2, 1:53pm
What is your definition of good?
Brisket
Jan 2, 8:40pm
I think the consensus assessment on Jake is that he isn’t an accurate passer. I agree with others that a deep ball shot
RootieBoy
Jan 2, 1:57pm
The reason I brought it up was because it was an INT straight into Sander's arms.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:00pm
BOOO... Who wants to be a QB for a fan base like ours? Go 11-2 and your fans aren't on your side? What? "Come to BYU
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 2:00pm
It’s a dumb way to show your support. We don’t even need a perfect offense if our defense keeps playing elite.
mulletino
Jan 2, 2:13pm
Is "Very Good" objectively true? He's the 62nd ranked QB by QBR. If he were top 25 it would give
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:22pm
Who are you suggesting we get to be QB1? What's your goal here? There is no one to replace Jake. Literally no one. So
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 2:59pm
Big12 Head Coaches (NOT randos like you) voted Jake 3rd best QB in Big12.
NYC and Japan
Jan 2, 3:22pm
If you’re interested, I didn’t say he was “very good” this year. I could have phrased it better.
mulletino
Jan 2, 3:42pm
What is your objective in writing this besides to whine?
MarylandFan
Jan 2, 7:44pm
I think your expectations are unreasonable. This isn't Madden.
SoCalCoug
Jan 2, 2:06pm
Well yeah. He's ranked 62nd in QBR. My mind instantly goes to "what if he were top 25 in QBR". Rare territory for BYU to
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:14pm
<< Deleted >>
chilawcoug
Jan 2, 2:10pm
Conflating a free-play INT muddles your whole point about INTs. INTs are mostly about poor decision making and throwing
mvtoro
Jan 2, 2:12pm
He did include it several times including 10 minutes before your post.
Ripliancum
Jan 2, 2:16pm
The point of my OP is that he's not accurate (and I did state that), so not sure what you are saying? I included it
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:26pm
The descriptions you gave of each actual INT were: “I’ll-advised”, “Not open at all”, “should have been thrown into the
mvtoro
Jan 2, 3:39pm
I would like to be CBer number 437 to completely ignore your point
YOHONOMOTO
Jan 2, 2:28pm
no thank you
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:30pm
I’ll be number 438
stoils
Jan 2, 3:10pm
Who do you think we should get? Who is going to come to Provo and move Jake to QB2?
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 3:03pm
Jake is probably our guy at this point so it's a moot point. But he has issues
YOHONOMOTO
Jan 2, 4:07pm
I didn't say I want Jake benched or that there is an obvious person to replace him. So many red herrings. I said he is
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 10:52pm
I hope he gets better but would love to see BYU go after a high profile QB in
SoValleyCOUG
Jan 2, 2:28pm
Not happening.
JuicyJam
Jan 2, 2:53pm
If the right young talent becomes available BYU should nab him for the future
puntersarepeople
Jan 2, 2:56pm
Probably not happening but BYU should try to improve at QB.
SoValleyCOUG
Jan 2, 3:10pm
How? Who? You guys keeping pointing out what you think is a problem, but you provide no solutions. How does this help?
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 3:12pm
Offer no help? Well if BYU calls me I'd happily give them advice.
SoValleyCOUG
Jan 2, 3:18pm
We should stop throwing shade at our coaches and players after an 11-2 season... especially when offering no solutions
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 3:28pm
Well I'll be sure to help the BYU coaches when they call me. In the meantime
SoValleyCOUG
Jan 2, 3:42pm
ouch... too soon man... too soon...
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 3:44pm
Good analysis. And correct tho inconvenient to acknowledge.
Lombardi
Jan 2, 2:29pm
The shuffle pass hit the TE right in the hands, chest high. Should have been
basman
Jan 2, 2:34pm
You are right - any single play it's hard to get upset about. When I look at his season objectively, he's not an
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 2:40pm
Jake will get better. Leavitt had 16TDs and 1 INT in his last six games
MyTwoCents
Jan 2, 3:10pm
Now do Jake...
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 11:38pm
I think you’re being too critical
Blue Heart
Jan 2, 3:37pm
Echoing HarlemCoug's question above - what are you hoping happens here?
CatManBlue
Jan 2, 3:46pm
Remarking on Jake's lack of consistency and accuracy doesn't always make you a hater.
BYUgoslav
Jan 2, 4:17pm
Jake needs our support... not our criticism.
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 4:35pm
For sure - I think it probably rarely makes someone a hater. I don't believe...
CatManBlue
Jan 2, 5:17pm
LOL you have been biased against Retzlaff since last season.
kaladin58
Jan 2, 6:01pm
It’s silly to focus solely on mistakes and ignore all the great plays Jake made.
WaybackCougar
Jan 2, 6:41pm
This (at the bottom) is the best point of them all. ALL QB's have errant throws
jaba166
Jan 2, 7:57pm
All of the critiques above need to stop worrying! Jake doesn't give a hoot what
jaba166
Jan 2, 8:07pm
Ouch, you were okay until you compared him with Bosco. Bosco’s numbers are far and away better than Jake’s.
Brisket
Jan 2, 8:44pm
Comparing the mistakes, not the overall numbers. And that was a different team,
jaba166
Jan 2, 10:27pm
I think his wins and accomplishments are well documented and celebrated. Great season overall.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 9:40pm
Then talk about that, then.
jaba166
Jan 2, 10:17pm
Everyone talks about the good. We get "The Cut", Blaine Fowler's blue-goggled take, Jarom and Spence's blue-goggled take
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 10:35pm
My question...
coventry94
Jan 2, 9:51pm
Nebraska proves that crazy fan expectations can ruin things. Bo Pelini was 67-27 at Nebraska. His worst year was
HarlemCoug
Jan 2, 10:16pm
That's a fair take. And it's yours. Mine is different, and it's also fair.
Haysom Till
Jan 2, 10:46pm
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