I'm generally not a fan of unions

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Sep 15, 2023
7:57:58am

Goliath CB users union organizer

But there is a certain amount of truth in what you say

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Goliath

Previous username: Koolio
Bio page: Goliath
Joined: May 25, 2005
Last login: Sep 7, 2024
Total posts: 31,363 (1,869 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

These UAW demands are amazing.

Abe Froman

9/15/23 7:35am

Seems like a non-starter to get pensions added back.

KingDave

9/15/23 7:40am

All you have to do is go through bankruptcy and the pension is worthless. 401k

TailgateU

9/15/23 11:04am

First rule of negotiation, anchor high. And UAW did just that.

WDaddy

9/15/23 7:41am

Worked great for the PAC 12.

Tokolosh

9/15/23 7:42am

The PAC didn't know when to back off the high demands. Same will happen to UAW

Corn Pop

9/15/23 7:48am

Betcha George Kliavkoff is advising the UAW 😃

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:57am

But the PAC didn’t have POTUS backing them. UAW might.

NYC and Japan

9/15/23 8:20am

Unless you're the pac12

machete

9/15/23 7:43am

Lol that’s true. They anchored high with no leverage and got called on their BS.

WDaddy

9/15/23 7:47am

AI and automation are not the threat to the US. It is the ridiculous expectations and sense of entitlement

BYU Tar Heel

9/15/23 7:44am

The concessions they got were really good so I don’t get the strike

Turnpike Lane

9/15/23 7:44am

UAW is asking for too much. Hollywood has been screwing over writers for decades

IrishBlue

9/15/23 8:22am

The writers who are valuable will get paid and the rest will be replaced by ChatGPT

BYU Tar Heel

9/15/23 8:36am

I think they’ll get the 32 hour week. Recent studies show it works

Longseason

9/15/23 7:45am

For office workers, not on a factory line. That’s crazy.

NotRelated

9/15/23 7:50am

Good point. Still think they’ll get it

Longseason

9/15/23 7:56am

I believe there are studies out of South Korean manufacturing plants that showed

downtownchrisbrown

9/15/23 8:00am

What happens when that becomes the norm and is too much for them? Workers then want a 28 hour work week?

No touching

9/15/23 8:08am

It isn't about what they want as much as what's productive. Sometimes less=more

runnincoug

9/15/23 8:19am

I keep hearing this but it seems like if it were true they wouldn’t have to

CaliforniaCougar22

9/15/23 8:28am

Alot of people don't believe research that contradicts their beliefs including

runnincoug

9/15/23 9:16am

As they are a union they do.

originalsocal

9/15/23 9:47am

But you then must hire more workers anyway. Or, just automate everything.

LeGrandBleu

9/15/23 8:29am

Productivity follows an S curve with a very truncated start. Workers fulfill the most valuable task first, then the next

RobertCohn

9/15/23 10:11am

Just remember how easy it is to lie with statistics. Productivity per hour

delbert

9/15/23 11:56am

I would think it would be more true for factory floor where the work is

IrishBlue

9/15/23 8:24am

But in an auto plant you are on a line. It doesn’t matter how energized you are,

cougsareforreal

9/15/23 1:46pm

UAW is just begging Ford and GM to ship jobs overseas 🤡

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:45am

Shift back to defined benefit pensions?

Indy Coug

9/15/23 7:47am

1965 called and wants its retirement plan back

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:49am

Wait. You can call people back then?

TNT

9/15/23 7:51am

Oh yeah, 1965 telegraphed and wants its retirement plan back

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:54am

Fascinating. Maybe TNT will call his grandmother

TNT

9/15/23 7:55am

Might have to bring in Pony Express for that one

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:57am

I like it. The defined benefit could be $1 per week.

TeeKaa

9/15/23 8:04am

That’s too high

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 8:09am

$1 quarterly.

TeeKaa

9/15/23 8:19am

Better, folks should be responsible for own retirement, that’s what 401k for!

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 8:57am

If they only have a DB plan, employer retirement contributions go WAAAAAY down.

TeeKaa

9/15/23 9:11am

I support the idea of unions but too many are way too greedy and turn me off

runnincoug

9/15/23 7:48am

Try being a first line supervisor at an OE and get back to me...

Catfish

9/15/23 7:52am

No thanks. But being a finance manager over a vehicle product line sure is stressful…

Tokolosh

9/15/23 8:01am

It's the worst.

MotorCityCoug

9/15/23 8:58am

I have mixed feelings. My step-father worked for Goodyear Aerospace and was a

AF_Puma

9/15/23 8:26am

I agree! Unions can be really important. I want to be pro union, but...

runnincoug

9/15/23 9:26am

100 years ago, yes. Now? Unions suck, especially the ones you listed.

TeeKaa

9/15/23 9:45am

As long as CEO pay is completely insane we will unfortunately need unions

Mitty

9/15/23 10:31am

CEOs get paid $$$ because they make the tough decisions that have huge impact. A person with even a slightly higher

RobertCohn

9/15/23 10:42am

Yeah, they do. Their huge bonuses show no correlation with doing a better or

Goliath

9/15/23 10:45am

That's not true at all.

Skeptical Optimist

9/15/23 10:48am

Yes, it is

Goliath

9/15/23 11:34am

Oh, we should have called you to assess how well CEOs are doing? What are your metrics?

RobertCohn

9/15/23 11:35am

There's really no evidence paying ceos more money gets you better people.

runnincoug

9/15/23 11:05am

That's why CEO pay has so many options involved. They should be paid for success

TailgateU

9/15/23 11:11am

They have leverage and can negotiate whatever they want. Shareholders (investors) are free to say no.

RobertCohn

9/15/23 11:43am

First of all, show a CEO getting paid billions that isn't entirely performance related pay (stock).

RobertCohn

9/15/23 11:39am

I've been on BoDs hiring CEOs as well and think you're way overselling their

runnincoug

9/15/23 11:46am

You must be working with some spectacularly average CEO candidates

RobertCohn

9/15/23 11:48am

When in doubt, say the evidence against you is politically motivated I guess!

runnincoug

9/15/23 12:00pm

Lol what? It's basic math bud. Someone running a $200 B market cap company can destroy billions of value instantly by

RobertCohn

9/15/23 6:34pm

You could not be more wrong. CEOs aren't these magical people that

Mitty

9/15/23 12:09pm

I have no issue paying the CEO of Ford 20 million per year when Robert Downey Jr

delbert

9/15/23 12:05pm

Half of super bowl winning qbs over the last 10 years have been in the BOTTOM

runnincoug

9/15/23 12:26pm

Does that stay true after they won? I would expect their next negotiation to start with “so, about that Super Bowl win”

TwinsRight

9/15/23 1:03pm

oh sure. But paying a QB 10x more than another doesn't predict a SB win like

runnincoug

9/15/23 1:54pm

Paying the good ones absolutely. However companies have some pathetic ones and

Blue for Life

9/15/23 4:00pm

Most of those demands are to recapture benefits that were taken away

Everyman

9/15/23 7:50am

Moral and economic high ground? To bring back pensions?

Iman23

9/15/23 7:52am

Those demands outrageous, they lucky US still has auto industry to provide jobs

Chad Francisco

9/15/23 7:53am

Correct.

shammy

9/15/23 7:59am

And then will proceed to lose all of those cushy jobs

nova_coug_fan

9/15/23 7:54am

I'm generally not a fan of unions

Goliath

9/15/23 7:57am

<< Deleted >>

Cougarmayn

9/15/23 7:59am

None of the automakers’ stock has been strong over the past five years

RevolutionDeathsquad

9/15/23 8:16am

They are only striking at a couple of plants because they know that their funds

AggieWeekendCougar

9/15/23 7:51am

Unions-where your pay scale is determined by the least productive person

Notparticularly

9/15/23 7:56am

Execs at car companies got a 40% pay increase over the past few years

Goliath

9/15/23 7:56am

If the GM CEO reduced her salary to $0 and distributed it across all GM workers,

Skeptical Optimist

9/15/23 8:07am

The point still stands

Goliath

9/15/23 8:18am

UAW employees all got profit sharing checks in addition to regular pay.

rad dawg

9/15/23 8:19am

I don't know all the facts and details of this issue

Goliath

9/15/23 8:25am

Execs don't work 32 hour weeks

rad dawg

9/15/23 8:33am

I don't think they went on strike because they weren't getting 32 hr work weeks

Goliath

9/15/23 8:45am

You must be an exec.

Y-Phile

9/15/23 10:10am

My last CEO was amazing. Guy worked 24/7 and implemented a strategy that will

LeGrandBleu

9/15/23 11:33am

RE: I don't know all the facts and details of this issue

AggieWeekendCougar

9/15/23 8:52am

GM profit for 2022 was $23 Billion. Mary Barra's $29 Million in compensation

Skeptical Optimist

9/15/23 8:22am

You completely missed the point.

Y-Phile

9/15/23 10:07am

This is TIC right?

rad dawg

9/15/23 8:19am

What if the execs had lost 10% over the past few years, would you be in favor of

Penske Material

9/15/23 8:28am

I, for one, can't wait to pay $85,000 for a Chevy Cobalt so that low skilled

Skeptical Optimist

9/15/23 7:58am

Kids who barely graduated high school never had it so good

KingDave

9/15/23 8:02am

Sarcasm? Getting a union gig out of high school and being to raise a family, buy

vagabonder

9/15/23 8:08am

My grandpa had that 40 years ago, and for many parts of the country these Union jobs dried up long ago.

KingDave

9/15/23 8:21am

Things are different now, yes. But look at house/car/toys/vacations etc. then.

Madam Pattirini

9/15/23 8:23am

They still can. But now everyone thinks they need two cars, a 3000 sq ft home, 4 iPhones, cable and high speed internet

RobertCohn

9/15/23 9:14am

Where can someone own a home, a car, afford health insurance, plus support a

vagabonder

9/15/23 10:32am

Minimum wage is an unfair target, though.

Madam Pattirini

9/15/23 12:04pm

I don't find it offensive, though.

Madam Pattirini

9/15/23 8:10am

I get wanting more pay but 32 hrs a week is just laziness

CaliforniaCougar22

9/15/23 8:11am

I get the raises but going to a 32 hour work week.

Blue for Life

9/15/23 8:42am

RE: I get the raises but going to a 32 hour work week.

Doogal McCougar

9/15/23 8:55am

All those workers are welcome to move there abs get a job.

Blue for Life

9/15/23 9:08am

I own a ford and every part of that car says “made in Mexico” or assembled.

Magneto

9/15/23 8:47am

All three companies will be bankrupt in the next 15 years. They are dinosaurs.

BostonCougar

9/15/23 9:11am

Not all three but likely one...

Catfish

9/15/23 10:26am

This will spur on the advancement of even more manufacturing automation. Why spend $40 billion on employee wages and

buhlcougar

9/15/23 9:14am

Exactly this.

BluebloodOR

9/15/23 9:18am

Exactly this +1

Mtbcoug

9/15/23 9:32am

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