The problem is that the current safety rules have rendered the old time onside kick almost useless.

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Jan 21, 2020
11:25:05am

shimmy All-American

The problem is that the current safety rules have rendered the old time onside kick almost useless.

This message has been modified

Originally posted on Jan 21, 2020 at 11:25:05am

Message modified by shimmy on Jan 21, 2020 at 11:27:42am

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shimmy

Previous username: AFCoug83
Bio page: shimmy
Joined: Jan 15, 2008
Last login: Sep 27, 2024
Total posts: 120,524 (37,579 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

Thoughts on this new way of doing "onside kicks"?

BlueVU

1/21/20 8:56am

Just silly. No team should have the ability of getting the ball back after scoring without earning it.

Indy Coug

1/21/20 8:58am

Does an onside kick “earn” it?

AD4

1/21/20 9:00am

About 1000x more than just saying "yeah, we'll take the ball at the 25"

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:01am

For a single play. I guess they also have the ball on the kickoff, they just have to be able to catch it after 10 yards.

AD4

1/21/20 9:02am

What's more likely, getting an onside kick or converting a 4th & 15?

Byron McNertney

1/21/20 10:03am

They're statisically the same, which is why the picked that as the alternative.

displacedute

1/21/20 10:21am

Yeah- because they have to execute a play, fight for possession, etc.

thaws

1/21/20 9:05am

Agreed, but not any more so than 4th and 15 (or 20).

AD4

1/21/20 9:07am

I agree- but I think that the argument was that they HAVE possession at that point already, did not earn possession

thaws

1/21/20 9:16am

I disagree. On a 4th and 15 the defense could be called for any number of penalties

unctoothman

1/21/20 10:42am

The penalty point is a good point.

AD4

1/21/20 10:45am

It's my only real objection. If you look at it, the likelihood of converting 3rd

unctoothman

1/21/20 10:56am

It’s a tough problem to resolve, because of you limit the impact of penalties,

russkiejedi

1/21/20 11:29am

Yes, but then you give the yards and replay the down. So they are still hurt.

unctoothman

1/21/20 11:35am

It needs to be an extreme risk, but have the chance of success that onside kicks had before the rule change.

shimmy

1/21/20 11:37am

That requires defensive discipline. Do your job and don't screw it up.

TailgateU

1/21/20 11:05am

Sure it does. But so does the lead that a team has worked 58 minutes to build.

unctoothman

1/21/20 11:20am

They'd earn it converting a 4th and 15

Deleted

1/21/20 9:01am

They didn't earn the opportunity to have a 4th and 15.

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:01am

They did. They scored.

YIsForBrigham

1/21/20 9:10am

They earned their points, but they didn't earn a turnover

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:12am

And they still have to earn that turnover with a difficult play, the same as an onside kick. Except if they are

AD4

1/21/20 9:14am

Most of the time they'll punt, giving the opposing team an opportunity to block

mwcoug

1/21/20 9:57am

They also didn't earn the right to kick it to themselves, either.

foofcoug

1/21/20 9:16am

Exactly. Why even have the possibility of recovering an onside kick? Just give the other team possession at the 25

AD4

1/21/20 9:26am

We would see more anger about PI calls giving them the first down, than anything

Cougar TD

1/21/20 9:15am

Make it nfl blitz rules

Deleted

1/21/20 9:18am

that's an interesting point

Scooter

1/21/20 9:21am

How is this not earning it? 4th and 15 isn't exactly a gimme

BigTex

1/21/20 9:01am

RE: How is this not earning it? 4th and 15 isn't exactly a gimme

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:02am

RE: How is this not earning it? 4th and 15 isn't exactly a gimme

AD4

1/21/20 9:03am

This is arguing that the rules can’t change because they shouldn’t change.

russkiejedi

1/21/20 9:36am

First, it's a solution in search of a problem, which is already a red flag.

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:38am

Then why even allow an onside kick? Why even give the kicking team an opportunity to gain possession before the

AD4

1/21/20 9:44am

The other team has the ability to prevent them getting the ball back on an onsides kick. In fact, they have

Indy Coug

1/21/20 9:47am

So on a one play scenario, does the opposing team not have the opportunity to play defense?

AD4

1/21/20 9:51am

That is a valid opinion, but it’s an opinion. One that can be expressed with “I

russkiejedi

1/21/20 9:50am

The problem is that the current safety rules have rendered the old time onside kick almost useless.

shimmy

1/21/20 11:25am

The odds of gaining 15 yards on one offensive down have to be

CommodoreCoug

1/21/20 10:01am

3rd and 15 was 16% in 2017

Indy Coug

1/21/20 10:03am

It’s been the onside kick alternative bantered about for a while. I’d like to see it implemented.

AD4

1/21/20 8:58am

It happened in that one league last year that folded before the season was over.

foofcoug

1/21/20 9:05am

I'd prefer a coin toss when under the 2:00-minute warning.

kccougar

1/21/20 9:00am

That definitely seems more in line with tradition in the NFL.

RobAdams

1/21/20 9:03am

This will make it difficult to “hold teams accountable.”

CougsBeatU

1/21/20 9:02am

Onside kicks are a slim chance of gaining possession...which is fair to the team in the lead. They earned the lead durin

Grit for Brains

1/21/20 9:06am

I think something a bit longer would be better—maybe a 4th and 20.

AD4

1/21/20 9:08am

Id much rather have something with a chance. Gimping onside kicks was dumb

Deleted

1/21/20 9:09am

I think it's a great idea to use the pro-bowl or an all-star game (baseball/basketball) to test out new rule ideas.

Bert609

1/21/20 9:10am

I like it. I suspect they'll get rid of kickoffs eventually with this as well. You get the ball at the 25 4th and 15.

YIsForBrigham

1/21/20 9:11am

4th and 30 is a lot more realistic, would be more fair and exciting

Hsaru

1/21/20 9:13am

It doesn't fit the normal flow of the game, like OT rules in college

doktorpfeffer

1/21/20 9:18am

It would be better if instead of offering to give an opponent the ball at the 25

TailgateU

1/21/20 9:18am

They should limit this to once or twice per game. There might be some teams that

AggieWeekendCougar

1/21/20 9:19am

Let them do that; that just gives the losing team a much better opportunity

OGSuperfan

1/21/20 9:20am

If that's the case, why do most teams punt at 4th and 15?

TailgateU

1/21/20 9:25am

Maybe last two minutes only.

thaws

1/21/20 9:26am

If they’re going to do it they need to do it all the time. No team up 14 points

akmewg

1/21/20 9:56am

I don't like contrived rules to try and make the end of games more interesting

mudpupper

1/21/20 9:23am

Yep. I call it a "seminary rule". From this scenario:

frontrowcougar

1/21/20 9:47am

50/50 long balls with refs calling pass interference like crazy.

valcorger

1/21/20 9:25am

I don't like it. Your team got in the position to be down and need a lucky

cougaman

1/21/20 9:28am

Don’t like it. Gets rid of the surprise onside kick, and who wants to see a team retain the ball on a defensive holding

CouchPotato

1/21/20 9:39am

It should be 4th and 15 every time. Teams would line up in punt formation and

TailgateU

1/21/20 9:45am

I actually love this,opening and half kickoffs only the rest are punts which are

akmewg

1/21/20 10:01am

I'm not sure, but I like the false start change.

Belboz

1/21/20 10:03am

Anything that gets kicking out of the game is fine in my book.

kotacoug

1/21/20 10:04am

Yeah- who needs feet in football

thaws

1/21/20 10:24am

4th and 15. Kick a FG, get the ball back 4th and 15. Kick another FG ..........

Count Cougar

1/21/20 10:21am

You'd still have to have a decent drive to kick a FG. Why is a FG relevant?

RobAdams

1/21/20 10:24am

Perfect strategy if you can consistently hit at 90 yards out.

frontrowcougar

1/21/20 10:50am

That's some fantasy-green rake stuff there, what 9pts a field goal? Who needs

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